Too often we think of people on the fringe whether it’s conspiracy theorists or cultists as people who are outside the range of human behaviour when actually they give us a hint of what is inside all of us. For this reason, I really enjoyed this conversation with visual artist and cinematographer Aaron Munson. He discusses his personal experiences with cult-like religion, the psychological and social dynamics that draw people to cults, and how media often oversimplifies these complex communities. Our conversation led to broader observations about the rising levels of anxiety and depression in society, and how our inability to face reality is a profound challenge.
“It’s all fantasy to a degree. The question is: which versions of reality are less distorted?”
— Aaron on how our perceptions of reality are always interpretive.
If there’s anything that human learning ecology has taught us, it’s that developing the ability to decipher what reality is as individuals and as a society is not easy. Yet it is crucial to our ability to operate adaptively and wisely in the world.
The Interview
Episode Outline
- Cults aren’t just fringe phenomena—they expose universal psychological needs for meaning, belonging, and certainty.
- When those frameworks collapse, individuals can experience profound disorientation and vulnerability.
- Healing can involve rediscovering meaning through curiosity, art, community, and personal exploration.
- All frameworks, beliefs, and experiences are interpretations—maps, not the territory itself.
- Holding beliefs with humility allows space for growth, new information, and compassion toward others.
- Science, when rooted in curiosity and humility, can be a spiritual pursuit. It offers one of the most reliable tools for understanding the world—but doesn’t always fulfill emotional or existential needs.
Quotables
“It’s all fantasy to a degree. The question is: which versions of reality are less distorted?” — Aaron on how our perceptions of reality are always interpretive.
“The waters of the psychotic and the mystic are the same. It’s just that one has learned to swim.” — A powerful metaphor for navigating complexity after belief collapse.
“What really makes sense to me is kindness.” — Aaron, reflecting on the most reliable principle in a chaotic world.
“Science has shown us how little we know.” — Aaron, on the humility embedded in scientific inquiry.
“All we want is not to be alone.” — Aaron, on the human need for community that cults often fulfill.
References
Man’s Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl
The True Believer: Thoughts on the nature of mass movements by Eric Hoffer
The Road to Jonestown: Jim Jones and Peoples Temple by Jeff Guinn
Credits
- Guest: aAron Munson
- Producer and Editor: Chris Hsiung
- Associate Producer: Dana Penrice, Mark Hopkins
- Human Venture Institute (humanventure.com) 2025
Email your comments, questions and ideas to podcast@humanventure.com or Ask Me Anything on http://humanventure.supercast.com/